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dpf1971:
OK ... nice list. First off let me say I'd love to have a bunch of these guys - but really, when you get down to it there are only a few tough guys on here that bring more OVERALL to the plate than Carlson. Some might have .... years ago. Chara, Webber, Kronwall, and Bieksa. Others are pretty much the same or near the same guy as Carlson but you'll never get them away from their teams or get them for the same money AND no NMC. Sutter, Hedman, Burns, Dougherty, Keith. And for the second section of your list - well most of those guys don't even come close to being as good at being an all-around defender. Sure McQaid will drop the gloves but he won't have half as many points, a ton more penalty minutes (something a top-4 defender can't have) and isn't nearly as mobile - ie. can't even get around on the ice that well. But I said shut-down guy right? I know, I did ask for those names - but in this day and age that the current game is - every guy has to be well-rounded. Carlson isn't perfect, I'll be the first to admit to it. But the game you want to be played doesn't exist or did; decades ago. But that second list I put up: Sutter, Hedman, Burns, Dougherty, Keith - in the minds of fans other teams, ie that doesn't watch Carlson 3 times a week, Carlson is probably a member of that list as well ... esp. after this year. He's in his prime and getting better, little by little, every year. We got him for market value - and we have him until we get rid of him or he retires. So why, other than he isn't going to get into any fights, are you bitching?
KitFisto:
--- Quote from: dpf1971 on Monday June 25, 2018, 03:55:17 PM Eastern ---So why, other than he isn't going to get into any fights
--- End quote ---
We have a bingo!
DC seems to think the path to the cup is with 4 lines of Tony Twist and 3 D pairings of Marty Mcsorley.
Not that I have any issues with tough guys.....love em, but you can't win with nothing, but tough guys.
dpf1971:
I will say this though. The one guy that brings, at least, a similar level of offense and defensive play but also adds in a serious degree of nasty .... which means he's really about the one guy I would take above Carlson on sheer face-value, is THIS SEASON's Byfuglien (holy fuck, I hate spelling that guy's name). I don't want my boy DC think I'm just out to beat up on him ...
Note: He makes 400K less than Carlson but has a modified NTC.
Mickstix:
Holy cow, can Carlson give me a loan? :wackysmile: I was expecting the long term, but 8x8??? Yikees..
Maacoshark:
--- Quote from: DC_1908 on Monday June 25, 2018, 11:46:12 AM Eastern ---Well, with out cap considerations, or lets just say players in the style of:
- Sutter
- Hedman
- Burns
- Chara
- Dougherty
- Webber
- D Buff (his last name is a bitch to spell)
- Phanuef
- Keith
- Kronwall
- Methot
- Olesniak
- Millar
- Bieksa
- McNabb
- McQuaid
- Stephen Johns
- Martinez
to name a but a few of the physical shutdown defenseman that according to some "canot play in this league anymore".
While they are smart enough to run a PP, or have a heavy enough shot in Burns case, to contribute offensively, it can safely be said that their primary assignments are defending against the top scorers of the other team, not trying to toe-drag and dangle behind the other teams net shortly followed by coasting watching the other teams odd-man rush and/or break away because no ones there to stop it.
Sure I listed some superstars that are some of the highest players in the league up there, but I also threw in a few little to unknown ones as well. If you go through the reports of of most NHL teams, you will see more shutdown/defensive defenseman on the current roster and in the systems than most would think or acknowledge existed. This type of player doesn't get numbers and doesn't get much attention/hype/promotion except when the ones they are playing against aren't scoring, or a hit/fight extra, ergo like Milar they get dubbed 'goons'. . .
[/quBuff,
Some good dmen in that list but some total pylons too. And get Burns off of that list. He isn't close to being a shutdow dman. He is pathetic defensively. Keith doesnt belong on that list either. Especially batter this season. He was bad. Real bad.
I really like some of those guys. Weber, Buff, Doughty and Hedman are all studs. You can put Pietrangelo in with those guys. I also love Kronwalls game. But his better days are behind him. Same with Chara.
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