Salary Cap Loopholes

[Maacoshark]

    I remember a discussion on the old page about NHL salaries. People were discussing some salaries that they wanted dumped from the Caps salary cap. I made a comment about teams finding loopholes to get around contracts. One member here argued with me that there was no way around the salary cap. Well obviously there is. The Leafs and Hawks used LTIR to free up cap space. And the Caps made a deal with Colorado that saved them 4 million in cap space and allowed them to get the player back. I bring this up because the NHL did investigate the Capitals for the Brooks Orpik transactions. They looked at the trade and signing and found the Caps did nothing wrong. I can see the NHL making some rules changes to stop teams from exploiting this loophole in the future.
      The ironic thing is when we discussing trying to dump salaries and I commented on finding a loophole, the contract in discussion was Orpiks.

[DC_1908]

    I remember a discussion on the old page about NHL salaries. People were discussing some salaries that they wanted dumped from the Caps salary cap. I made a comment about teams finding loopholes to get around contracts. One member here argued with me that there was no way around the salary cap. Well obviously there is. The Leafs and Hawks used LTIR to free up cap space. And the Caps made a deal with Colorado that saved them 4 million in cap space and allowed them to get the player back. I bring this up because the NHL did investigate the Capitals for the Brooks Orpik transactions. They looked at the trade and signing and found the Caps did nothing wrong. I can see the NHL making some rules changes to stop teams from exploiting this loophole in the future.
      The ironic thing is when we discussing trying to dump salaries and I commented on finding a loophole, the contract in discussion was Orpiks.

Good call!  More than any sport, for every rule in the NHL, someone finds a way to exploit it.  This would either by design in negotiations, or one side being taken advantage of in them.


More than likely BetaMale made Grubuar and Hooks a “package deal”, and either Colorado “outbid” everyone, by “implying” they’d just buyHooks out of his contract to get Grubs, or most likely it was just dumb luck they did and Hooks wanted to stay with Reidon after his payday, and Colorado got Grubs which was there goal.


The later is more feasible.

[Mickstix]

I don't really see it as a loop hole, cause (unless Im mistaken) they lost control of Orpik's contract? Dumb luck or rather, no one else being that interested, is the reason he's back.

[Maacoshark]

I don't really see it as a loop hole, cause (unless Im mistaken) they lost control of Orpik's contract? Dumb luck or rather, no one else being that interested, is the reason he's back.

    The league did investigate but couldn't find anynbwrong doing. I'm sure all parties involved in the deal discussed it and likely knew that this would be the final outcome. Yes this was as salary cap loophole. Why else would the NHL investigate the transaction? There was even rumors it would happen before Orpik even signed here.

[Mickstix]

I just see "loopholes" as when you're exploiting something w/o the risk of losing anything.. Orpik became available to any team who wanted to pay him, didn't he? I guess if they'd agreed that would turn down any offers and return to the Caps, that could be seen as a violation, but as far as I know no one wanted him.. Or at least no one wanted him bad enough to pay him more than the Caps?

[alta]

yep, a loophole indicates a legal work around because of inaccurate or vague language

[DC_1908]

yep, a loophole indicates a legal work around because of inaccurate or vague language

Heh which is how all NHL agreements are written 🤣

[Maacoshark]

I just see "loopholes" as when you're exploiting something w/o the risk of losing anything.. Orpik became available to any team who wanted to pay him, didn't he? I guess if they'd agreed that would turn down any offers and return to the Caps, that could be seen as a violation, but as far as I know no one wanted him.. Or at least no one wanted him bad enough to pay him more than the Caps?

    How would you know if anyone wanted Orpik? I heard rumors that other teams had contacted Orpik.

[Mickstix]

    How would you know if anyone wanted Orpik? I heard rumors that other teams had contacted Orpik.

I just figure if anyone wanted (TO PAY) him, he'd be playing there, no? 

[alta]

Teams contact other players all the time, that in-upon itself is meaningless

[DC_1908]

I just figure if anyone wanted (TO PAY) him, he'd be playing there, no? 

Well. . ., Hooks has always been about preserving his career, as noted by his reluctance to fight (granted he’s done actually done that a handful of times the past couple years), to avoid head injury, to a history of being “injured”, (aka vacations), over the years.


Coming here he’ll get lower minutes (i doubt he’ll see more than 12min a game, if that), be under his coach giving him even more of a leadership role, and a good route to get into coaching

[Mickstix]

Coming here he’ll get lower minutes (i doubt he’ll see more than 12min a game, if that), be under his coach giving him even more of a leadership role, and a good route to get into coaching

All good points!! That would all get trumped by a payday..

[Maacoshark]

I just figure if anyone wanted (TO PAY) him, he'd be playing there, no? 

    Pretty sure Orpik wanted to stay in Washington.

[Mickstix]

    Pretty sure Orpik wanted to stay in Washington.

See: Reply #11

[PUCKNRUSH]

I just figure if anyone wanted (TO PAY) him, he'd be playing there, no? 

Perfectly logical conclusion, Mick!👍
Now my rambling reason why. LOL


Local coverage here, reported two significant things that had to take place, in order for a POTENTIAL return, by Orpik, back to the Caps, to be LEGAL:
1) Washington could NOT buyback Orpiks remaining contract from Colorado. If they did, Orpik becomes ineligible to return to them, without a waiting period, (I believe either 1 yr, or until January).
2) Colorado could buy Orpik out, OR, any team except the Caps, could buy Orpiks contract from Colorado, since they owned it via the Gruby deal.


Colorado knew, in advance, they were not going to put Orpik on their roster. THEY, first tried to shop him, (maybe a few days), accepting that it was not likely to get any takers, and they were prepared for the buy out and release of Orpik, already. THEY WANTED GRUBY! Credit GMBM for understanding Colorado’s desperation for a goalie, and “padding the Gruby ticket” with an inclusion of Orpiks contract value. That is NOT a loophole. That is called finding the right buyer, same thing ANY agent would try to do for his player/client!  GMBM simply did it for HIS “CLIENT”, The Washington Capitals!!


Once Colorado bought out Orpiks contract, and released him, he was a free agent, with the liberty to accept ANY OFFER he pleased, from ANY NHL team. Orpik may very well have preferred to return to the Caps, but this does not diminish the risk to the Caps, that existed, if other offers were to ensue.
This “risk of loss” burden, put upon the Caps, IMHO, was why NHL found nothing illegal, as from a transactional point of view, there wasn’t a “loophole” found, to guarantee Orpiks return to the Caps, rather, another team, (Colorado), that was was WILLING, to somewhat OVERPAY, in order to fill an IMMEDIATE need. The very essence of what trade negotiations are all about! In this case, a win/win for both us and the Avalanche!
It is not a long leap to conclude that, even if there were other offers for Orpik, from other teams, they were subpar in Orpiks view. However, I seriously doubt there were any other offers, because Colorado would have jumped at them, to get back even minimal value for Orpik, AND, the Caps weren’t permitted by NHL rules, to buy Orpiks contract back from Colorado! Now THAT....would be attempting to exploit a LOOPHOLE!!! (Oh yeah...and why I agree with you, Mick)😁😁


Rush

[Maacoshark]

    Pretty sure that all went down the way it was intended.

[alta]

Orpik isn't the first time this kind of thing has been done. It's a risky move because the Caps might not have gotten him back. It was a high risk calculated move that worked, this time.

[Maacoshark]

Orpik isn't the first time this kind of thing has been done. It's a risky move because the Caps might not have gotten him back. It was a high risk calculated move that worked, this time.

   It is likely that all parties involved knew what was going to happen. I dont think it was a high risk move. Would have it been the end of the world if we didnt get him back? I thought if we needed a veteran on defense we could have tried to sign Hamhuis. Ended up we didnt need to.
   

[PUCKNRUSH]

   It is likely that all parties involved knew what was going to happen. I dont think it was a high risk move. Would have it been the end of the world if we didnt get him back? I thought if we needed a veteran on defense we could have tried to sign Hamhuis. Ended up we didnt need to.
   

Guarantee you GMBM, also, never considered it anything close to a high risk move, Maaco. Respectfully, to say that all parties KNEW what was going to happen is simply not factual. It’s called a calculated risk!! And even that doesn’t do it justice, when the risk is very small, compared to one of the main factors of the ENTIRE DEAL!!!.....Orpiks boat anchor contract, tied around the neck of the entire Caps organization!
Therefore I make the case that there wasnt ANY pre-planning as to whether we could “get Orpik back”! Rather, GMBM saw the opportunity to deliver some justice to Grubauer, which he had spoken of prior, AND dump that MAMMOTH Orpik contract, off on somebody else!! Genius move in and of itself! Any GM would have jumped all over it. I doubt Orpik returning, at that point was even in the discussion, as it’s such a non-factor to the whole of the deal!
I will say, After the dust settled, I sure am glad he’s back, however, as we have SO MANY youngins!


Rush

[Maacoshark]

    I never said it was a fact. It is speculation. It is my opinion that Orpik and the Caps discussed this option before the trade was made. After the trade was made there was rumors that the Avalanche would buy out Orpik and the Caps might sign him. This was before Colorado even bought out Orpiks contract. As soon as that deal was made everyone knew Orpik would get bought out.