Washington Capitals Fan Forum
Talk about Capitals hockey & more! => Washington Capitals & Other Hockey Discussion => Topic started by: zerofox on Thursday April 04, 2019, 12:08:10 AM Eastern
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A lot talk recently about Ovi's chances of catching Gretzky's record, and a lot of debate around who the best goal scorer of all time is. Frequently the answer is Gretzky, and supporters of that answer point to his 894 goals. To which others will say "yeah but era." To be honest though, I don't think any of that really matters. I think if Ovi wins his 8th Rocket, that will pretty firmly make him the best goal scorer ever without debate.
Here's some metrics people might use to determine the best goal scorer ever, and why I think they work or don't work:
Total Career Goals - This metric points us to Gretzky as the best, but it doesn't adjust for era or longevity of career. Gretzky played in an era where goalies had the bodies of malnourished vegans and goals were a dime a dozen. Of course he's going to score plenty. Plus he played 20 seasons (nearly 1500 games). 894 goals is very impressive in a vacuum, but 894 goals over the course of 20 seasons largely in a high scoring era? A little less impressive.
Career Goals per Game - This metric would point us towards Mike Bossy being the best, but it also doesn't take into consideration the era. Play in a high scoring era and you'll have a high goals per game average. You also could keep a relatively short career and maintain a high G/GP average. Bossy had a record .762 G/GP, but also kept a relatively short 10-year career, which basically covers his prime years.
Era Adjusted Total Career Goals - This metric is most frequently used by the pro-Ovechkin crowd, because he's already 6th in era adjusted goals with 737, and would surpass Gretzky's 758 next season and end up 3rd all time. However, looking at this metric right now would say Gorgie Howe is the best. Yes this takes into account the era, but still doesn't take into account longevity of career. Gordie Howe's 925 era adjusted goals were done over 26 years (almost 1800 games). Of course you could argue that once Ovechkin's career is over, he could very well end up with over 925 era adjusted goals. But I think there would always be some doubt around the validity/accuracy of the formulas used to adjust for era. In other words, questions like "does the formula make the right assumptions" and "can you know for certain that Ovechkin would score X% more in Y era" would pop up. There will always be a group of people who have to "see it to believe it" and have no interest in speculating how many goals Ovi would score if he played in the 80s.
Goal Scoring Leads (Rocket Richards) - I think this measure is good enough to determine who's the best goal scorer of all time. It adjusts for era, because it doesn't matter if you played in a high scoring era or a low scoring era. You can win just as many Rockets scoring 30 goals a year in a hypothetically low scoring league as you could scoring 80 goals a year in a high scoring league. It also somewhat adjusts for longevity of career, because you could win 10 Rockets in 10 years, or win 10 Rockets in 20 years (with the last 10 years likely being your "down years" where you have a harder time winning more Rockets). But at the same time it still attributes some value to having a long, healthy, consistent career (you need to play enough seasons at a high level to win a lot of Rockets). To win a single Rocket is to say you were the best goal scorer among your peers, regardless of era. To win a lot of Rockets is to say you had a consistently strong career, without giving you too much benefit for playing until you're a pensioner. If Ovi wins his 8th, I think it's a very easy argument to make.
I think the only real counterargument you could make to using Rocket Richards as a metric for best goal scorer is the fact that Gretzky only won it 5 times, Howe only won it 5 times, and Bossy 2 times. You would also then argue that Lemieux and Brett Hull both only won 3 times. And all those guys are great goal scorers so what gives? But then I would probably say that if they didn't win the Rocket more, they either weren't consistently good enough as goal scorers relative to their peers, or just weren't all that special if they were getting beaten left and right by other players.
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well....
to do further research to assist in the pro-ovechkin is the best scorer of all time, one would have to take the time to watch every goal gretzky etc scored and figure out which ones would have been saved due to bigger goalie pads/bigger goalies.
you could then "subtract" those goals to make the argument more..even? (i cant brain right now)
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OV. Hands down. The goaltending is vastly better during OVs career than it was previously, which makes OVs achievement that much more impressive, and I don't think a player could get this close to an equal number of goals and assists over 13 seasons if they tried.
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I agree that today’s goaltending is vastly superior than what it was when Gretzy played. On the other hand today’s hockey sticks are a lot better than the old wood sticks that players used back in the day. I am not exactly sure when the new compsite sticks came into the league but I know players like Gordie Howe and Rocket Richard did not have them.
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The annual rewriting of the rule book, and the consistent economic clusterfuck of the NHL in last 40 years makes a side by side comparison of offensive statistics essentially pointless.
Ovie and Gretzky both benefited and suffered from changes made between the ages they played in. Salary Cap, Two Line Pass, Composite Sticks, Curves. four or four minors, obstruction, interference, video scouting, the list of changes that need to be considered in this comparison are damn near infinite.
So who’s second and third best/most accomplished goal scorer behind Mr. Hockey isn’t gonna have a definitive answer.
But I’ll tell ya one thing, if shotgun to my head I had to take a puck to the nuts from Gretzky or Ovie, ‘deed there’s no question I’m choosen Gretzky cause he ain’t breakin 110mph
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At this point I'm praying Ovi hangs on and wins the Rocket. Draisaitl is close thanks to his 2 goals last night. He plays the Flames tomorrow who have clinched and may rest some players. Ovi on the other hand plays the Islanders who still have something to play for, and I'm guessing TR may rest some players tomorrow. There's a small chance, but a chance nonetheless, that Ovi doesn't score tomorrow and Draisaitl gets a hat trick. The Oilers have nothing to play for other than to get Draisaitl 50, and if he hits 50 I'm sure the guys will try to get him 1 more to tie Ovi for Rocket, and at that point they may try to get him the hat trick.
Kinda hoping that if Draisaitl gets 51 he decides to stay there and take the tie with Ovechkin rather than denying him his 8th Rocket. Seems like the respectful thing to do...
Either way, I'd want Ovi to get his 8th Rocket, whether he is alone or tied with someone. Just get him his 8th. And after that I'm happy to let some other players win the Rocket going forward, but to get this one would be big.
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I took a stab at answering this a while back. I calculated the average goals for forwards and the standard deviation for the various years. That's not super scientific because it assumes a random distribution but... Ovechkin is something like 7 or so standard deviations above the average. Statistically that's crazy.
A lot of the calculation depends on how you determine who scores goals.
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I took a stab at answering this a while back. I calculated the average goals for forwards and the standard deviation for the various years. That's not super scientific because it assumes a random distribution but... Ovechkin is something like 7 or so standard deviations above the average. Statistically that's crazy.
A lot of the calculation depends on how you determine who scores goals.
Yep, there are a shotloaf of factors to take into account for a side by side comparison. Like I said above, how do you accourtly factor in salary cap compared to rule changes? How do you account for Also, “stat-taient” has provided far more data, ie we can say “Ovie scored X percentage of goals from X area in X situation compared to Gretzky, but that data Gretzky data doesn’t exist.
Come to think of it, granted we’re at a bar for brunch and I’m four(ish) drinks in. An interesting comparison would be to compare the totals against the league at there time. IE what percentage of the total goals did they score, what was there rank in in comparative seasions, how many more did they have than the runner up?
IOW if a hypothetical player led the league in goals with 55. and the second had 36, third had 34, and a second hypothetical player had 70, but the second had 64 and third had 60, is second “better” for scoring 15 more in comparitive years? Heh enter standard divinations and formulas of the ilk I have somewhere, and otter programs I’m a bit to buzzed now to do on my phone at a bar!
Regardless, Jack Daniels is the best brunch!
Oh and great fuckin post btw!
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Well congrats to Ovi for officially winning his 8th Rocket. 8 50 goal seasons and 8 Rockets for #8 has a nice ring to it, hopefully followed by 800 goals and of course some more Cups.
Oilers/Flames game last night was a bit of a nail biter since Draisaitl had been on fire down the stretch and hit 50 early on in the game. On game 32 of the season, Ovechkin had a 10 goal lead over Draisaitl. By the last game, that lead had fallen to 1. Pretty damn impressive if you ask me. I think if the season lasted a few more games Draisaitl might have had a shot at taking it.
I'm hoping Ovi can will his team to the Cup again, despite whatever TR does to screw things up.
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Damn Ovies “on pace” for 61. . .
He won't get 60, but I'd love for him to hit 50+ again. I think he will.
Hell, if he gets 20 more this year for 54, that would put him at 712 he could nearly catch Jagr at 766 next year (with another 54G year)
I think Ovi will catch Gordie at 801 before he retires. He would only need about 90 more after this season. I think he can average 30 over the next three seasons if he stays healthy
But I don't see any realistic way for Ovi to catch Gretzky....at 894 by the way.
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I remember an interview with Gretzky when he was traded to NY and had played about half the season, he said he could've played another 5 years if his entire career was in the east because of the easy travel
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He won't get 60, but I'd love for him to hit 50+ again. I think he will.
Hell, if he gets 20 more this year for 54, that would put him at 712 he could nearly catch Jagr at 766 next year (with another 54G year)
I think Ovi will catch Gordie at 801 before he retires. He would only need about 90 more after this season. I think he can average 30 over the next three seasons if he stays healthy
But I don't see any realistic way for Ovi to catch Gretzky.
I bet OV signs a deal to retire with Backy in 5 years. If so, he only needs 203 goals to beat him. OV appears reinvigorated for the challenge, needs to average 41 goals a year to do it in 5, and if he's close and healthy I bet he signs a 1 year deal just do it. He's now tied with Yzerman and could easily pass Gartner this year.
1: Gretzgy 894
2: Howe 801
3: Jagr 766
4: Hull 741
5: Dionne 731
6: Esposito 717
7: Gartner 708
8: Messier 694
9: Yzerman, Ovechkin 692
the talking heads on tv keep bringing up his age, but it's a different world these days, guys don't smoke anymore, most don't drink like they used to, and sports nutrition didn't really exist 15 years ago
and nice necro post :snicker:
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Ovi is currently third all time in PPG
Andreychuck 274
Brett Hull 265
Ovi 258
I'd say he will easily surpass these PPG numbers to become #1 in NHL history, almost certainly next season.
Andreychuck played 1639 games (wow)
Hull played 1269
Ovi is currently at 1133
If Ovi could play another 506 games to match Andreychuck's 1639, I'd say he'd easily catch Gretzky in goals
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Not to mention how the players now block shots as well.
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I bet OV signs a deal to retire with Backy in 5 years. If so, he only needs 203 goals to beat him. OV appears reinvigorated for the challenge, needs to average 41 goals a year to do it in 5, and if he's close and healthy I bet he signs a 1 year deal just do it. He's now tied with Yzerman and could easily pass Gartner this year.
I hope so. I would also hope he does it at a reasonable price to make it happen. It could mean a lot to the team and franchise and his name in history
IF he gets another 16g this year for an even 50, that would tie him with Gartner at 708, and...
actually, Ovi would then need "only" another 185G goals to surpass the Great One....which IF he play 5 more years would be 37g per year. That would also make him 39 or 40 and would add roughly another 400 games (including about 30 this year, and averaging 75 per year the next 5) giving him roughly 1532 games played (Wayne played 1487)
I guess if he could play long enough Ovi could possibly catch Gretzky in goals and possibly even in fewer games played
IF that were to happen, I don't think you could reasonably argue that OVI was NOT the greatest goals scorer ever. Especially considering the eras in which all these guys played.
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and nice necro post :snicker:
Is this what you meant by Necro?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necro_(rapper) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necro_(rapper))
He's one of my favorite gangst rappers :wtf:
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(https://thecollegiatelive.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/59.png)
Is this what you meant by Necro?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necro_(rapper) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necro_(rapper))
He's one of my favorite gangst rappers :wtf:
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Is this what you meant by Necro?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necro_(rapper) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necro_(rapper))
He's one of my favorite gangst rappers :wtf:
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=necropost
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always so literal...
but barfing's was funnier
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https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=necropost (https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=necropost)
And by the way...when I clicked on your link
I would like you to know that the pop up adds that showed on my computer were NOT gay porn, but rather
adds for Northern Tool infrared heaters
and Workpro wide mouth tool bag
and Duluth Trading (buck naked underwear)
so :raspberry:
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:laughing:
right, what adverts really popped up
:lol:
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SO..... before you judge...
THIS IS THE BOREDOM THREAD....
Ovi is currently at 698 goals and 8th in ALL TIME goals ever
He will (should) pass Mike Gartner this year who has 708, (if Ovi can manage 11 more goals this year - which would also give him another 50g season).
Ovi should surpass Phil Espisito (717), Marcel Dionne (733), and Brett Hull (741) next year (if Ovi manages 10 more this year and 30+ goals next year) which would put Ovi at #4 on the all time list by end of next season.
THat would leave only Jagr (766), Mr. Hockey (801) and The Great One (894) ahead of Ovi. Ovi will easily surpass Jagr and should surpass Mr Hockey with relative ease in the coming seasons
Ovi will have to work at it to catch Gretzky at 894. I think it's possible but it would require roughly 37-38 goals a year average for 5 more seasons (If Ovi ends this year with 50)
What's more amazing is...go look at the NHL all time goal leaders. Of the top 100 there are only a handful still playing (actually there are 6)...meaning only a handful of Ovi-era players are even in the top 100 and none near his level of goal scoring. Ovi was born in 1985. There is not a single player born in 80's in the top 50 on this list, and only 7 players in the top 100 (51-100)s, and most of those well behind Ovi. Nobody within 50 ranking spots of Ovi.
Ovi is currently 8th with 698. The next closest has 243 fewer goals:
Cindy (#58) with 455
Kovalchuck (65) with 441
Staal (71) with 434
Stamkos (84) with 418 (actually Stamkos was born in 1990 so he's a bit younger)
Malkin (93) with 408
Patrick Marleau was born in 1979, but I'll give him props - he is next highest (to Ovi) of all current players with 561 goals (ranking him at #25). He is 40 and likely this is his last year, and he has played 1708 games - 429 more (roughly 5.25 more seasons) than Ovi.
There are only four players ever with (10 or more) 40 goal seasons...Gretzky (12), Ovi (11), Dionne (10), Lemieux (10) (Gartner (9), Bossy (9)
Most 30 goal seasons: Gartner (17), Ovi (15), Jagr (15), Gretzky (14), Dionne (14)...and I'd expect Ovi will get two more to catch Gartner
Ovi is certainly the best goal scorer of this generation, and probably the best ever with all else considered. Catching Gretzky would certainly cement that.
Despite the year Ovi is having, I do think father time will start to wear on him in coming seasons. I expect him to remain a viable threat, but don't expect he will maintain the 50 goal pace (or even 40 really).
Anyway, GO OVI
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What also be noted is Gretzky wasn’t scoring at the same rate Ovie was at the same age, Gretzky had his last 40 goal season when he was 30.
Jager put up 54 at age 33 then only put up 30 twice in until he was 45
Since turning 30, Ovies hit 50 twice, 49 once, and has 40 goals in 53 games this year.
He’s constantly averaged .6 GPG for his career. While being 200 away from breaking the record, at .6 a game pace that he’s constantly maintaining, we’re looking at 122 games from today.
There’s little sign that this rate will drop off in the next two years
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Id bet money that OV signs a short term deal so he can retire with Backy, that'd be in five more years barring a serious injury. It appears 900 goals is well within reach. His current contract was very front end heavy, he's already made his fortune. Hopefully he sees the benefit of not running Ted over the coals so the team can get more talent in here, kinda like Zimmerman just did
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Uh, Ovie's current contract was NOT front end loaded. His annual salary was $9 million for its first 6 years, $10 million for the last 7. Regardless, it is true that he has made a mint during his time here, and I think the entire organization would say that he has been well worth it.
I agree that he may agree to a 4-year deal this time, expiring at the same time as Backstrom's new deal. I do expect, though, that it won't be "cheap." I think because of the realities of pecking order, it will be higher AAV than Backstrom's deal. In addition, Ovie knows that there is going to be a LOT of attention on him if/when his goal totals pass the remaining people in front of him and he attempts to scale Mt. Gretsky, and he will want to share in the financial reward that such a chase would bring to the franchise. I personally think that he will not reach the summit because his big minutes and heavy style of play will deteriorate his offense before he can mount a serious challenge. I would say his chances are better than even to reach 800 goals and become the #2 all-time goal scorer. The last 90 are going to be very hard for him to come by.
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My money says he signs 1 year deals (after this next contract) until he breaks the record. Barring injury, he's gonna break the record.. :uh-huh:
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Let's say he ends up with 715 goals by end of this season (which is 17 more goals in nearly 28 games remaining, a .60 goals/game average).
Next five seasons:
-50
-40
-35
-30
-25
That assumes some decline due to age and still puts him at 895.
To note, Selanne was scoring 40+ goals a season around age 35-36 or so. Closer to age 40 he was still at a 30+ goal a season pace (fell short at times due to injury). Ovechkin is a superior goal scorer to Selanne, so I think the numbers above are quite conservative. I think after 4 seasons if he hasn't beaten the record, he'll be dangerously close to it. Close enough to say "fuck it I put off retirement one more season just to get this record."
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And following up on my prior post, no one knows how many more seasons Ovie will play, or how many goals he'll score per season.
Here's a quick little table I made showing how many goals he might need to score after this season to beat Wayne, and how many seasons he'll need to play depending on his scoring rate. If he scores at a .55 goals/game rate or better, he can do it in 4 seasons (will be 38 in his final season). But if he plays 5 full seasons, his goals/game rate can be as low as .45 and he can still beat the record.
Simply put, he's got a really good chance
(https://imgur.com/a/yiDaK81)(https://imgur.com/HxLPhaF)
(https://i.imgur.com/HxLPhaF.jpg)
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Uh, Ovie's current contract was NOT front end loaded. His annual salary was $9 million for its first 6 years, $10 million for the last 7. Regardless, it is true that he has made a mint during his time here, and I think the entire organization would say that he has been well worth it.
13 years ago, $9M a year was a shitload. The fact that it remained at $10M for so long would indeed count as front end loaded. Especially when goalies are now making that, and not earning it. That and inflation is a real thing.
a better way to put it is, what is a bigger hit against the salary cap? $9M 13 years ago? Or $10M today??
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My money says he signs 1 year deals (after this next contract) until he breaks the record. Barring injury, he's gonna break the record.. :uh-huh:
That be alright in my book. Even if he comes in second you could still make the argument that he is the greatest scorer of all time.
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Let's say he ends up with 715 goals by end of this season (which is 17 more goals in nearly 28 games remaining, a .60 goals/game average).
Next five seasons:
-50
-40
-35
-30
-25
That assumes some decline due to age and still puts him at 895.
To note, Selanne was scoring 40+ goals a season around age 35-36 or so. Closer to age 40 he was still at a 30+ goal a season pace (fell short at times due to injury). Ovechkin is a superior goal scorer to Selanne, so I think the numbers above are quite conservative. I think after 4 seasons if he hasn't beaten the record, he'll be dangerously close to it. Close enough to say "fuck it I put off retirement one more season just to get this record."
It can be done in 4, maybe 3, (at .6 GPG) but there will be a cost.
The Caps will need to be, and will be in full out STAT PAD mode for the next 3-4 years until this the record is broke.
Cups, series, or wins will be put aside for this record. . . and even I wouldn’t blame them for it this point.
Ovie breaking Gretzky’s record in three years is not unrealistic. Caps getting two or three Cups and Ovie breaking the record IS.
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Ok.
This corona bullshit needs to eat a dick and die.
OV needs every extra game to hit 900+ goals
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Ok.
This corona bullshit needs to eat a dick and die.
OV needs every extra game to hit 900+ goals
I heard Gretzky went to China and started this shit.... :snicker:
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I heard Gretzky went to China and started this shit.... :snicker:
Bettman told him to bc "no damn russian will be the best at 'our' sport"
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Bettman told him to bc "no damn russian will be the best at 'our' sport"
Do people here think Gretzky was the best?
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I do, I don’t think there is much question about it.
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I do, I don’t think there is much question about it.
I wish we coulda gotten to see more of Lemieux. He was a phenom.
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Do people here think Gretzky was the best?
Gordie
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I was at a game some years ago when this player got 7 points in one game, shortly after that he got an attitude and was a worthless addition to this team, damn shame too, I’m sure he’s well respected outside of the DC area
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I was at a game some years ago when this player got 7 points in one game, shortly after that he got an attitude and was a worthless addition to this team, damn shame too, I’m sure he’s well respected outside of the DC area
Eric Lindros?
Daniel Alfreddson?
Jaromir Jagr?
All 3?
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Eric Lindros?
Daniel Alfreddson?
Jaromir Jagr?
All 3?
this is a Capitals website, so kinda narrows it down
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this is a Capitals website, so kinda narrows it down
Alfreddson played for a division rival and was traded to another team
Lindros played for a division rival and was never traded (technically)
Jagr played for you and a division rival...
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... and ain't NONE of them the "greatest goal scorer of all time". :smirk:
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Alfreddson played for a division rival and was traded to another team
Lindros played for a division rival and was never traded (technically)
Jagr played for you and a division rival...
Jager played very few games here, he showed up for the vast majority of his time as a Capital
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... and ain't NONE of them the "greatest goal scorer of all time". :smirk:
if jager hasn’t copped an attitude here then took several years off from the nhl, he would’ve gotten pretty damn close to Gretzky on goals scored. Possibly even passing him. As I said, it’s to bad he gets no respect in this town, but he earned that. What will never be surpassed is Gretzky’s points total.
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In addition, Ovi is also spent one season outside of NHL due to lockout if not that he could have right now roughly 800 goals at the age of 34..
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In addition, Ovi is also spent one season outside of NHL due to lockout if not that he could have right now roughly 800 goals at the age of 34..
and another half season from the second lockout
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and if we’re lucky, just 13 games and the playoffs from a flu shortened season
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Buttman should have the teams finish the season with NHL ‘19, they can do that from home over the interwebs
I should dust off my NHL ‘15 and see if I can win the Cup :uh-huh:
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I do, I don’t think there is much question about it.
I personally didn't like his game. Yes he was a fantastic offensive player. He wasn't as pure a goalscorer as an Ovi or Bossy but he had great vision and could see the play developing before anyone else. He did however have alot of holes in his game and he wasn't a 200 foot player. He was surrounded by alot of very good talent.
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Jager played very few games here, he showed up for the vast majority of his time as a Capital
Didn't Jagr apologise for his stint in DC?
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Didn't Jagr apologise for his stint in DC?
as I recall, he acknowledged it, not really apologizing for it
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Ovie sits at 730 Goals. He needs 165 goals to pass the Great One.
If he does indeed sign a 4 year deal, it is very possible he could surpass Gretzky by the end of it....
assuming he stays healthy...
and we don't have another pandemic...
I don't see him bringing home another Cup with this roster and the current cap problems. Unless Samsonov turns into Marty Broudeur or something, and Johnny Q Norris turns into...a Norris candidate...and McMichael comes up and more than blossoms in Kuzy's vacated spot.....etc, etc.
So....for Ovi....I think realistically as far as "career accomplishments" goes....it's Gretzky for the next four seasons.
For the record...Ovi is in 6th place at 730
Dionne with 731
Brett Hull 741
Jagr 766
Gordie 801
The Great One 894
If not for the flu shortened seasons... Ovi would have passed Dionne, Hull, and maybe Jagr already.
I expect Ovi will pass all three this season, and Gordie next.
Let's hope it tons of fun to watch, and not a "sacrifice of all else" to get there.
Go Ovi
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just a point on that, no player has ever scored 800 goals with one team. Gretzgy played for
three four teams, forgot about the Blues.
and according to the nhl, OV is one of two to score 700 goals with one team. Those two records most likely will never be broken.
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just a point on that, no player has ever scored 800 goals with one team. Gretzgy played for three four teams, forgot about the Blues.
and according to the nhl, OV is one of two to score 700 goals with one team. Those two records most likely will never be broken.
especially when Ovi gets to 900 with the Caps :uh-huh:
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I'll admit I'm biased because I am a Caps fan and I never got to see the Great One play but I'll go with Ovie.
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Don't ever forget the effect of the evolution of goaltending training, coaching, and equipment. Gretsky had a MUCH easier scoring environment than Ovie has had.
In most of the era when Gretsky played goalies routinely put up save percentages in the mid to high 80's. Much of the time Ovie has been in the league save percentages have moved into the low 90's.
It doesn't sound like all that much difference, but you have to look through the other end of the telescope to understand how significant the difference is. A goalie with a .889 save percentage lets 1 of 9 shots in. A goalie with a .917 save percentage lets 1 of 12 shots in. Less than a 3 percentage point change in save % makes it 25% more difficult to score. (Or you could say in the earlier era it was 33% easier to score. Take your pick. Depends on which reference point you want to use as the denominator of the %.)
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(condensed content) blah, blah, blah....to use as the denominator of the %.)
Which Star Wars movie was this evil "Denominator" in anyway? :wackysmile:
Just trying to get this thread back in the running ;D
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OV could pass jagr tonight in Edmonton, game starts at 8
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Congrats to Ovie...3rd place all time.
I'm not a twitter guy, but I saw some twit feed and one twittard comment was Ovie tied Jagr with an ENG...and he has 7 this year so he is the most Dangerous scorer if the team has no goalie. Yeah, well, they all count dickhead. Goal scoring is not really a fair comparison one era to another anyway so Ovie's goal scoring today is much more impressive than those of yesteryear IMO.
I looked and couldn't find the stats on ENG.
One thing that surprised me a bit was Ovi has 120 GWG which puts him 2nd place all time. Gretzky had only 91. Gordy also at 120 and Jagr leads all with 135. There are about 15 guys above Wayne from 91 to 118 GWG
Ovi has tied Jagr with 766 goals, but done so in 480 less games played.
Ovi needs one more 50 goal season to tie Wayne and Bossy who have the most with 9. He likely would have already except for a few short seasons.
Also needs one more 40 goal season to tie Wayne with 12 for most ever, which I expect Ovi will accomplish this season.
Not sure Ovi will get that 50, but prolly this year is going to be his best shot. He is on pace for 50.89 this season currently.
while we are at it....Ovi needs one more 30 goal season to match Gartner with 17. Next year baby!
and....He currently has 17 20-goal seasons...Jagr, Shananah, Andreychuk all have 19 - which I believe Ovi will match in time. Ron Francis has 20, Gordy 22. Ovi will probably catch Ron with 20, but doubt Ovi hangs around for 22 seasons.
Ovi is the only player to score 700 with one team.
Go Ovi.
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if I remember correctly, OV would have had the most consecutive 30 goal seasons until the wuhan shortened season stopped that
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Congrats Great 8 on another milestone.
40 goals this season ties Ovi with Gretzky with TWELVE season with 40 goals
Ovi has eight (50) goal seasons (so far), Gretzky and Bossy have 9. I'd like Ovi to get 50 this year, but I don't think it happens.
Ovi has 16 (30) goal seasons trailing only Gartner with 17
Ovi has 17 (20) goal seasons. There are 10 players with 17, three players with 19, and Gordie with 22. I expect with four season after this one, Ovi will likely reach the 19....20...21 mark, but doubtful he plays 22 seasons to get a chance to tie Gordie with 22
Ovi has suffered two shortened seasons of 48 and 45 games. He did manage 32 and 24 goals (but cost him chance at both 40 and 50 and a 30) in those two seasons
Despite his age, Ovi seems to be able to continue to score at a great pace. I expect he will slow some, but I think he will catch Gretzky if he manages to play through the end of his contract (4 more years) without major injury.
Ovi currently has 770, Gretzky has 894. 125 to go Ovi. That's about 30 goals per season...lots of records/milestones to tumble with those numbers.
Personally, I'd like Ovi to achieve two more 50's, one more 40 and two more 30's to stand alone with all those records. I don't see him getting two 50's but time will tell.
Go Ovi.
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Congrats Great 8 on another milestone.
40 goals this season ties Ovi with Gretzky with TWELVE season with 40 goals
Ovi has eight (50) goal seasons (so far), Gretzky and Bossy have 9. I'd like Ovi to get 50 this year, but I don't think it happens.
Ovi has 16 (30) goal seasons trailing only Gartner with 17
Ovi has 17 (20) goal seasons. There are 10 players with 17, three players with 19, and Gordie with 22. I expect with four season after this one, Ovi will likely reach the 19....20...21 mark, but doubtful he plays 22 seasons to get a chance to tie Gordie with 22
Ovi has suffered two shortened seasons of 48 and 45 games. He did manage 32 and 24 goals (but cost him chance at both 40 and 50 and a 30) in those two seasons
Despite his age, Ovi seems to be able to continue to score at a great pace. I expect he will slow some, but I think he will catch Gretzky if he manages to play through the end of his contract (4 more years) without major injury.
Ovi currently has 770, Gretzky has 894. 125 to go Ovi. That's about 30 goals per season...lots of records/milestones to tumble with those numbers.
Personally, I'd like Ovi to achieve two more 50's, one more 40 and two more 30's to stand alone with all those records. I don't see him getting two 50's but time will tell.
Go Ovi.
FWIW, I think Ovie gets to 50 this year only if he can get a hat trick or two 2-goal games in the remainder of the season. I don't think he'll quite make it picking off goals one at a time.
"Without serious injury" goes without saying. A Hagelin can happen to anyone, any time. What a durn shame for him.
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Well....I figure it's about time to revive this thread.
Ovi reaches another milestone with 800 and approaches yet another record to break. One goal needed to tie Gordie Howe for 2nd place in goals.
Playing tonight vs Detroit seems like a good time to do that, and Ovi hasn't scored a goal in the last 2 games. What, he gets a hattie and thinks he can not score for a few games? What a slacker.
Ovie (1307) has currently played 180 fewer games that Gretzky (1487), and 460 less than Mr. Hockey (1767). Both Wayne (2857) and Gordie (1850) have more points than Ovi (1445) will ever reach.
Ovi's lifetime GPG is .612 so at that rate he needs roughly 155 games to eclips the Great One for most goals all time with 895. I expect Ovie won't score at .612 GPG, but to reach the goal record with fewer games played than The Great One, Ovi needs to score 95 goals in the next 179 games so - .531 GPG pace.
Go Ovi
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And then there was one....
Ovi surpassed Mr. Hockey with goals 801 & 802 in Caps home game vs Winnipeg, Dec 23, 2022 for 2nd place all time.
It would be nice if Ovi got 50 this year. He has been shorted at least three seasons - he should have the record for the most 50 goal seasons already.