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Niskanen
Devise:
--- Quote from: Maacoshark on Tuesday May 22, 2018, 08:29:16 AM Eastern --- Are you making this up as you write it. Carlson lead the Caps in too in the regular season and he also leads in the playoffs. How does that translate to one game? My point is that Carlson has been better than Niskanen and Orlov in these playoffs.
--- End quote ---
I just don't get how you can see that. Carlson has been good offensively all these playoffs, absolutely. Carlson has been steady defensively, since about Game 4 of the Pitt series imo. But he was actively bad defensively against Columbus. So for you to continue to say "these whole playoffs" when you only mean that Carlson was better than Orlov/Niskanen defensively for what, 3 games this series? The 3 games we lost no less. Carlson was bad defensively the entire Columbus series. He was simply steady against Pitt. Where as Nisky and Orlov were both good against Columbus and literally great against Pitt. And then again they were both good against Tampa in some games this series defensively. Game 1 and 2 both good, and I thought they were both great last night.
Carlson was worse defensively than they were last night, more of the quality chances came against his pairing and when Djoos was on the ice. Djoos is obviously our weakest link defensively, i'm not crazy enough not to see that. But the narrative that you've woved that Carlson has somehow been better in our own end is wild. He is the most guilty party of just slapping the puck up the boards, which Orlov and Niskanen only do in situations when the forecheck is coming in too hot. Even ignoring breakouts, the amount of times Nisky and Orlov show up holding the blue line, and taking steals out of the neutral zone against Pitt and in Games 1, 2 and 6 of this series is impossible not to see. The forwards clog lanes and it allows the defenders to step up and keep the forecheck and the cycle going and going and going. It allows us to control flows of the game, but it's still a defensive play. Add that to the number of times once they do get a skate in, again this is against both Pitt in Tampa same games I mentioned, it's almost often Orlov/Nisky stepping up and stealing the puck or outplaying the man after the first move to end the chance. Even when they get beaten, they then tip or push the puck into the boards and box out to allow other forwards to come in.
I'm not denying they had those couple of bad games this series, they absolutely did. But in the games where our defense has been a shining point, Orlov/Niskanen have been our two best defenders defensively, with Orpik third, easily. Hell I'd probably put Kempny as more of a standout defensively in those games than Carlson. The only difference in Carlson is he's more composed and it allows him to stick to the system and play steadier when he's in the D zone. It means he makes less awful plays, not more quality defensive plays. The other three defenders I mentioned have easily made far more quality defensive plays game to game on a consistent basis, whether it's big quality defensive plays like pushing the puck off the line, or the little things that go unnoticed like interrupting breakouts, or pushing the puck into corners and allowing it to turn into board battles that our forwards can win. They simply have a better mind for defensive hockey, that is obvious.
Maacoshark:
--- Quote from: Devise on Tuesday May 22, 2018, 01:01:23 PM Eastern ---
I just don't get how you can see that. Carlson has been good offensively all these playoffs, absolutely. Carlson has been steady defensively, since about Game 4 of the Pitt series imo. But he was actively bad defensively against Columbus. So for you to continue to say "these whole playoffs" when you only mean that Carlson was better than Orlov/Niskanen defensively for what, 3 games this series? The 3 games we lost no less. Carlson was bad defensively the entire Columbus series. He was simply steady against Pitt. Where as Nisky and Orlov were both good against Columbus and literally great against Pitt. And then again they were both good against Tampa in some games this series defensively. Game 1 and 2 both good, and I thought they were both great last night.
Carlson was worse defensively than they were last night, more of the quality chances came against his pairing and when Djoos was on the ice. Djoos is obviously our weakest link defensively, i'm not crazy enough not to see that. But the narrative that you've woved that Carlson has somehow been better in our own end is wild. He is the most guilty party of just slapping the puck up the boards, which Orlov and Niskanen only do in situations when the forecheck is coming in too hot. Even ignoring breakouts, the amount of times Nisky and Orlov show up holding the blue line, and taking steals out of the neutral zone against Pitt and in Games 1, 2 and 6 of this series is impossible not to see. The forwards clog lanes and it allows the defenders to step up and keep the forecheck and the cycle going and going and going. It allows us to control flows of the game, but it's still a defensive play. Add that to the number of times once they do get a skate in, again this is against both Pitt in Tampa same games I mentioned, it's almost often Orlov/Nisky stepping up and stealing the puck or outplaying the man after the first move to end the chance. Even when they get beaten, they then tip or push the puck into the boards and box out to allow other forwards to come in.
I'm not denying they had those couple of bad games this series, they absolutely did. But in the games where our defense has been a shining point, Orlov/Niskanen have been our two best defenders defensively, with Orpik third, easily. Hell I'd probably put Kempny as more of a standout defensively in those games than Carlson. The only difference in Carlson is he's more composed and it allows him to stick to the system and play steadier when he's in the D zone. It means he makes less awful plays, not more quality defensive plays. The other three defenders I mentioned have easily made far more quality defensive plays game to game on a consistent basis, whether it's big quality defensive plays like pushing the puck off the line, or the little things that go unnoticed like interrupting breakouts, or pushing the puck into corners and allowing it to turn into board battles that our forwards can win. They simply have a better mind for defensive hockey, that is obvious.
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Lol you should really watch that Columbus series again. It was Orlov and Niskanen that sucked in the first round. Especially Orlov. And they had a couple bad games in this series.
And BTW Carlson gets moire mins than either of those 2 , even with few pps. He is playing very well for us.
Mickstix:
I hope it's not fatigue or minutes causing some of these errors on D.. Niskanen, last game, started screwing up about a minute in.. lol They've all done some bonehead plays this post season, but I repeatedly notice Nisky doing suspect shit.. Hope he and the rest of em' tighten up for tonight!! Should get to see the best of both teams..
DC_1908:
--- Quote from: Maacoshark on Tuesday May 22, 2018, 07:23:34 PM Eastern --- Lol you should really watch that Columbus series again. It was Orlov and Niskanen that sucked in the first round. Especially Orlov. And they had a couple bad games in this series.
And BTW Carlson gets moire mins than either of those 2 , even with few pps. He is playing very well for us.
--- End quote ---
Debating who's better defensively: Carlson. Nisky, and Orlov, is like judging a rally fat beauty contest. Aint none of em good.
Devise:
--- Quote from: DC_1908 on Wednesday May 23, 2018, 12:36:47 PM Eastern ---
Debating who's better defensively: Carlson. Nisky, and Orlov, is like judging a rally fat beauty contest. Aint none of em good.
--- End quote ---
One area I actively disagree with you on I think. Especially in some games these playoffs, really most, for Nisky. Orpik has by far been our physically effective D, but against Columbus and Pitt Nisky was stellar. Like stellar, defensively. He didn't looked panicked or rushed at all imo, and while he wasn't playing perfect hockey every single night, he had some amazing defensive plays that helped win us games. It's obviously been team efforts to in some cases, but I've seen some really good plays by him this post season, and from my vantage point he's bailed us out far more than he's hurt us this post season. Far more. Pitt and Columbus alone make up for the what 3 games he had bad this series?
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